? Silience

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Re: ? Silience

Postby Vandervecken on Tue 18 Sep 2012 11:28

Cralis wrote: the asteroid goes into a nice orbit around the nearest body.


Hmmm, Would Raquel Welch count if she was near, she certainly once had a heavenly body. Boy, does that date me; but she didn't. Sorry, very tired; should be asleeeeep.

So no 'Footfall' (Niven & Pournelle) kind of nasty stuff, eh ??
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Re: ? Silience

Postby Crucis on Tue 18 Sep 2012 11:56

Vandervecken wrote:
Cralis wrote: the asteroid goes into a nice orbit around the nearest body.


Hmmm, Would Raquel Welch count if she was near, she certainly once had a heavenly body. Boy, does that date me; but she didn't. Sorry, very tired; should be asleeeeep.

So no 'Footfall' (Niven & Pournelle) kind of nasty stuff, eh ??


Dave Weber also had the Terrans dropping asteroids on to Bug homeworlds in the novel about the 2nd half of IWS4, "The Shiva Option" (though dated as you are, I suspect that you may already know this). I don't recall if they were included in SDS' ISW4 scenario module or not. IIRC, in TSO, the Alliance installed some sort of engines (not regular I/Ic type engines) on the rocks to make them self-propelled, rather than towing them. However, this took something like a year to accomplish, but within a game perspective, a year seems like a long time to dedicate to building a "weapon" to take out a Bug homeworld, when a crapload of fighters would probably a lot easier.
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Re: ? Silience

Postby AlexeiTimoshenko on Tue 18 Sep 2012 17:57

Crucis wrote:Dave Weber also had the Terrans dropping asteroids on to Bug homeworlds in the novel about the 2nd half of IWS4, "The Shiva Option" (though dated as you are, I suspect that you may already know this). I don't recall if they were included in SDS' ISW4 scenario module or not. IIRC, in TSO, the Alliance installed some sort of engines (not regular I/Ic type engines) on the rocks to make them self-propelled, rather than towing them. However, this took something like a year to accomplish, but within a game perspective, a year seems like a long time to dedicate to building a "weapon" to take out a Bug homeworld, when a crapload of fighters would probably a lot easier.


It's mentioned but not allowed in the supplement. 3rd/Cosmic has no engine analog to the drives used in the novel. The LEL Cp drive from SSF is the closest drive system I can find in the game.

The novel is actually the 2nd time David has used bombardment by asteroid. In Nexus 12 the Rigellians under Ozho Fwari bombarded their own homeworld to finally end the Rozhark great rebellion. (pp 8-9)
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Re: ? Silience

Postby Cralis on Tue 18 Sep 2012 19:25

By the rules, David Weber did illegal stuff in his novels on a number of occasions. He is credited with writing the original CLASSIC STARFIRE rules and setting the tone for the technologies, yet he does things in the novels you can never do in the game. Asteroid bombardment is one. Another time he sent a drone on a ballistic path past a WP to scan it. And funnier, it would have taken MONTHS to do at STARFIRE speeds so he did a second break on how fast he got it moving.

It's called "literary license."
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Re: ? Silience

Postby Crucis on Tue 18 Sep 2012 19:52

Cralis wrote:By the rules, David Weber did illegal stuff in his novels on a number of occasions. He is credited with writing the original CLASSIC STARFIRE rules and setting the tone for the technologies, yet he does things in the novels you can never do in the game. Asteroid bombardment is one. Another time he sent a drone on a ballistic path past a WP to scan it. And funnier, it would have taken MONTHS to do at STARFIRE speeds so he did a second break on how fast he got it moving.

It's called "literary license."


Actually there was also one that occurred in the final WP battle in Crusade, wherein he had the Terrans refits a boatload of freighters with ECM3 and sent them thru the WP to the Theban home system with their ECM3 set to make the FT's look like warships. The oopsie is that ECM doesn't work in the first turn after transit. He actually made note of this in the Crusade scenario book.
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Re: ? Silience

Postby AlexeiTimoshenko on Tue 18 Sep 2012 19:58

Cralis wrote:It's called "literary license."


I heartily agree. Asteroid bombardment is far beyond the scope of the game.

Would it be possible to use Cp drives to move a moonlet sized asteroid to a more favorable orbit for AF construction? I'm thinking of within a single interception hex, say to increase the orbit by a tH or 2 to limit the area blocked by a mass 3 gas giant. In 3rd ed Jupiter is a full tH across. Given the smaller hex size it is 2 tH's across. An AF orbiting at 1 tH would have a severely reduced field of fire.
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Re: ? Silience

Postby AlexeiTimoshenko on Tue 18 Sep 2012 20:01

Crucis wrote:Actually there was also one that occurred in the final WP battle in Crusade, wherein he had the Terrans refits a boatload of freighters with ECM3 and sent them thru the WP to the Theban home system with their ECM3 set to make the FT's look like warships. The oopsie is that ECM doesn't work in the first turn after transit. He actually made note of this in the Crusade scenario book


Forgot about that one. The sad thing I that I have all 4 of the original Starfire novels bookmarked on my phone for instant access.
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Re: ? Silience

Postby Dawn Falcon on Thu 20 Sep 2012 09:23

Crucis wrote:However, this took something like a year to accomplish, but within a game perspective, a year seems like a long time to dedicate to building a "weapon" to take out a Bug homeworld, when a crapload of fighters would probably a lot easier.


Yes, I never really figured why they did that, when it gave the bugs plenty of time to send mass gunboat waves out. Oh well.

(If you have the force to protect the asteroids, you have the force to crack the defences anyway - but David does like his themes, and he's used asteroid impactors in other fiction as well - The Armageddon Inheritance)
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Re: ? Silience

Postby AlexeiTimoshenko on Thu 20 Sep 2012 17:40

Speaking of literary license, how the heck did 3 CA's take out most of the mothballed units at Galloway's Star in Insurrection. Kongo got off 2 salvo's. Revenge and Oslabya got in one salvo each on the yard. Assuming Bulwark class CA's each cruiser had 3 Wa's. I can see 24 nukes killing the civilian population and destroying the fleet base, but there is no realistic way that the mothballed fleet would have been destroyed. Remember that the other 3 ships in the battlegroup were Pomern (another CA) and 2 DD's. Pomern did help destroy skywatch and the defending DD's but then reversed course to take on BC Kris.
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Re: ? Silience

Postby Crucis on Thu 20 Sep 2012 18:30

AlexeiTimoshenko wrote:Speaking of literary license, how the heck did 3 CA's take out most of the mothballed units at Galloway's Star in Insurrection. Kongo got off 2 salvo's. Revenge and Oslabya got in one salvo each on the yard. Assuming Bulwark class CA's each cruiser had 3 Wa's. I can see 24 nukes killing the civilian population and destroying the fleet base, but there is no realistic way that the mothballed fleet would have been destroyed. Remember that the other 3 ships in the battlegroup were Pomern (another CA) and 2 DD's. Pomern did help destroy skywatch and the defending DD's but then reversed course to take on BC Kris.



Alexei, IIRC, Insurrection was written at a time when the rules were that a single nuke could destroy a ship without a drive field. That's probably why those CA's did so much damage to the mothballed units.
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