Jump Drives, Mines, Swarms, Hull Costs, etc.

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Re: Jump Drives, Mines, Swarms, Hull Costs, etc.

Postby tmul4050 on Mon 12 Aug 2013 05:58

Firstly, I don't think Crucis will be using Alkeda dawn rules for various reasons.
But as to the questions raised, hmmm, interesting

I would say the advantage is to the attacker. The defender will have to react to a large force which could be up to two to three turns away. Spread your forces and you get eaten up in detail. concentrate and its a crap game to be in position.
If I was defending the point vs that drive, I would deploy bases, with capital missiles and fighters, in packs of say nine big bases (BB or SD size). Lace these forts so they over lap fire. 15 hexes apart. That would be around 324 bases for a basic cover. Fill the space between with Idews. Lots of Idews.

Have a fleet of fast (speed six) ships armed with capital missiles, and carriers. Fast SDNs (if you have them), battle cruisers if not. base on the warp point, with a rolling GQ. make the fleet large if you can.

The bases and Idews damage and tie down the attacking fleet. With a bit of luck you might get two or three base packs in range. launch your fighters and him damage more. Bring your fleet in and rubble him.

Of course this is with a LARGE budget. :D

If you don't have a large budget then I would base the biggest fleet I could afford on the warp point and charge them on emergence. Fighters would be a requirement to slow the enemy down.
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Re: Jump Drives, Mines, Swarms, Hull Costs, etc.

Postby Crucis on Mon 12 Aug 2013 13:08

tmul4050 wrote:Firstly, I don't think Crucis will be using Alkeda dawn rules for various reasons.
But as to the questions raised, hmmm, interesting

I would say the advantage is to the attacker. The defender will have to react to a large force which could be up to two to three turns away. Spread your forces and you get eaten up in detail. concentrate and its a crap game to be in position.

If I was defending the point vs that drive, I would deploy bases, with capital missiles and fighters, in packs of say nine big bases (BB or SD size). Place these forts so they over lap fire. 15 hexes apart. That would be around 324 bases for a basic cover. Fill the space between with Idews. Lots of Idews.

Have a fleet of fast (speed six) ships armed with capital missiles, and carriers. Fast SDNs (if you have them), battle cruisers if not. base on the warp point, with a rolling GQ. make the fleet large if you can.

The bases and Idews damage and tie down the attacking fleet. With a bit of luck you might get two or three base packs in range. launch your fighters and him damage more. Bring your fleet in and rubble him.

Of course this is with a LARGE budget. :D

If you don't have a large budget then I would base the biggest fleet I could afford on the warp point and charge them on emergence. Fighters would be a requirement to slow the enemy down.


Against a fleet using the Alkelda Dawn version of the jump drive, I don't think that any static defense is viable. There's too much area to cover and the immobility of bases would make it impossible for them to concentrate their fire. Of course, given that jump drive carriers would be exiting the WP randomly, it may not be necessary to have any extreme degree of concentration of fire by the defense helps.

But on the whole, I'd tend to think that bases would be a bad investment here. I think that the size of the area into which AD jump drives could randomly exit requires the use of mobile forces. Not only that, slower, heavy capital ships might also be at a disadvantage defensively if the attacker decides to use faster ships, i.e. BC's or smaller, in some sort of raiding attack. Slower, heavy capital ships tend to be at their best on both sides of traditional WP assaults where speed is less important than other factors.

A problem that bases have in this model is that attacker isn't required to engage the bases to exit the WP area, unless the bases are so numerous that they can't be avoided, and then you're talking about a rather incredible number of bases. An attacker might jump into the system with the intention of raiding colonies or attacking a shipyard, and if the bases cannot follow the attacker, then what good are they? Even fighter-bases would be of limited utility since they also could not follow an attacker who chose to ignore the bases and head in-system. Heck, for that matter, I'm of the general opinion that even placing a concentrated mobile defense fleet close to the WP because it's a central position in the 100 tac hex circle around the WP is a flawed strategy, because it assumes that the attacker is interested in attacking the defense fleet.

But what if the attackers choose to ignore the defense fleet to head in-system after a colony or shipyard? I tend to think that the best position for the concentrated fleet is between the WP and whatever is seen as the most likely in-system target (such as a shipyard), and at least 100 tac hexes from the WP so that no exiting jump drive ships get behind the fleet upon transit. Of course, this does allow the attacker more time to concentrate, but it also means that the defender is guarding whatever he sees as his most valuable asset in the system.
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Re: Jump Drives, Mines, Swarms, Hull Costs, etc.

Postby tmul4050 on Thu 15 Aug 2013 07:12

Crucis wrote:Against a fleet using the Alkelda Dawn version of the jump drive, I don't think that any static defense is viable. There's too much area to cover and the immobility of bases would make it impossible for them to concentrate their fire. Of course, given that jump drive carriers would be exiting the WP randomly, it may not be necessary to have any extreme degree of concentration of fire by the defense helps.


I agree that static defenses are not much use, I was joking a bit above. My plan above would have a massive cost. However carrier bases may still be useful.

A question though. Do fleets arrive at one point or do ships arrive scattered over the whole area? If the the second then a fast, coordinated squadron (or several) would be very effective.
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Re: Jump Drives, Mines, Swarms, Hull Costs, etc.

Postby Crucis on Thu 15 Aug 2013 12:09

tmul4050 wrote:
Crucis wrote:Against a fleet using the Alkelda Dawn version of the jump drive, I don't think that any static defense is viable. There's too much area to cover and the immobility of bases would make it impossible for them to concentrate their fire. Of course, given that jump drive carriers would be exiting the WP randomly, it may not be necessary to have any extreme degree of concentration of fire by the defense helps.


I agree that static defenses are not much use, I was joking a bit above. My plan above would have a massive cost. However carrier bases may still be useful.

A question though. Do fleets arrive at one point or do ships arrive scattered over the whole area? If the the second then a fast, coordinated squadron (or several) would be very effective.



According to the AD rules, scattered. This is a reason why I'd try to load the ships of a datagroup onto a single jump carrier as much as possible.

And yes, against an WP assault by forces that are going to end up scattered across a 100 tac hex radius circle, a number of fast reaction squadrons would be useful. However, I still believe that the first priority is to place a strong blocking force between your most important asset in the system and the WP outside of the 100 tac hex circle, so that that blocking force cannot be flanked the instant enemy ships start jumping into the system. if you have enough strength in the system, I suppose that you could place the fast reaction squadrons in a central location within the 100 tH circle in addition to the main blocking force outside the circle. The FR sqdn(s) could attempt to hunt down some of the enemy ships before they get a chance to concentrate, while the blocking force prevents the enemy from reaching a valuable asset (a hab planet, perhaps) without being engaged.
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Re: Jump Drives, Mines, Swarms, Hull Costs, etc.

Postby tmul4050 on Mon 16 Dec 2013 03:50

Anyone still here? Its been 4 months and nothin.
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Re: Jump Drives, Mines, Swarms, Hull Costs, etc.

Postby Cralis on Mon 16 Dec 2013 10:00

tmul4050 wrote:Anyone still here? Its been 4 months and nothin.


Crucis has been on a hiatus for personal reasons. He'll be back... like the rest of us, he can't keep Starfire out of his head for long!
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