Strategic Intelligence ... aka how to learn about aliens

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Re: Strategic Intelligence ... aka how to learn about aliens

Postby olivertheorem on Thu 02 Feb 2017 20:53

While I get the idea behind different kinds of IP, I don't know that tracking that many has a benefit that outweighs the bookkeeping cost. I'd think it would be simpler to have one pool of IP but the level of info you can get scales with the treaty status. For example, you may have a 1% shot at military info on a limited trade treaty, but that gets to 10% at higher levels.
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Re: Strategic Intelligence ... aka how to learn about aliens

Postby Cralis on Thu 02 Feb 2017 21:11

Hmmm... that's true, we could also scale chances against the actual treaty instead of having the treaty determine IP earnings.
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Re: Strategic Intelligence ... aka how to learn about aliens

Postby Elminster on Fri 03 Feb 2017 04:23

Cralis wrote:
Elminster wrote:Imperial Intelligence Agency (IIA)

But I like your name better. Mind if I squirrel that away into my notes?

Seems like it is already adopted. :lol:

And I wouldn't have suggested the name if I wouldn't wanted it to be used in the first place. 8-)
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Re: Strategic Intelligence ... aka how to learn about aliens

Postby Whitecold on Fri 03 Feb 2017 15:33

Cralis wrote:That's true. You could have only generic "IP" but then you'd want to roll for what kind of information is found, before rolling on what the information is. That could lead to situations that may be illogical (such as learning military information when your IP is generated by trade).

I see that most information comes from traders anyway, that see things, as well as tourism, cultural and scientific exchange, where I assume that the volume of the last three scales mostly with how close the empires are. (aka trade treaty again)
EL assistance there some additional IP may be gained, but for other research assistance, few enough people are involved that not more information than the assisting empire wants revealed should come out.

I'm thinking more of what you'd find in the public. Such as a newspaper article about the launch of a new class, or a "Jane's" book on older existing classes, or stuff like the politician saying to the news "The KON cannot break 'The Wall' of forts at Redwing!"

The question is what information about the military is public. Simply getting info on a random system/random class doesn't take into account. I haven't ever played with the old intelligence rules that can be found, but if they take any operational security measurements into account, I must have over read them.
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Re: Strategic Intelligence ... aka how to learn about aliens

Postby Cralis on Tue 07 Feb 2017 16:37

The more I think about this, the more I keep thinking that we might even want to create a "dossier" style form to help the player organize what he knows about other empires. And it's not just strategic information either, in the past I have personally kept tactical intelligence such as HTK and designs of ships that I have scanned, last known ship positions, fleet compositions, technologies observed, and even notes on prefer tactics or procedures I've observed.

Does anyone else do this? What do you put in your collected information about other races you encounter in your games?
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Re: Strategic Intelligence ... aka how to learn about aliens

Postby dazrand on Wed 08 Feb 2017 06:39

Does anyone else do this? What do you put in your collected information about other races you encounter in your games?


Yes I do. Careful note taking during combat, even going as far as to modify your firing strategy, can reveal the designs and capabilities of ships.

On the strategic level, I tracked everything I could and in one game had a map of the universe (from trade partners and other sources) which covered about 20 times the number of systems I had.
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Re: Strategic Intelligence ... aka how to learn about aliens

Postby Cralis on Wed 08 Feb 2017 12:37

Oh that reminds me, back in ISF when intercepting comms was easier, I always kept a list of names of places and things I had encountered in stolen comms (rarely fromelsewhere)
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Re: Strategic Intelligence ... aka how to learn about aliens

Postby olivertheorem on Mon 14 May 2018 18:10

Was driving to work this morning when I had a thought about how to handle strategic-level intelligence without introducing an entirely new mechanic to the game. Will probably need to be fleshed out by veterans, but I thought I'd throw it out there.

We need a new facility: the Embassy. The idea being, an official embassy would easily serve as a front for spies. It would be a trade offer of a sort (could be 2 kinds, one to put the embassy on the other race's home planet, and another for elsewhere in the empire), which if accepted would work thus. Player pays X MCr and uses 1 FSP (of his own) to build an embassy in the NPR's space. Having said embassy would have some minor benefit to trade offers (no idea what the particulars would be), but you can ALSO use it for spycraft. For example, you could have "focused spying", similar to a focused research breakthrough, where you can specify the info you're trying to gather, and you could also have "random spying", more like random breakthroughs.

THEN, if you have embassies in your territory and want to make sure they're not spying, you can invest funds in counter-espionage (maybe even to the point where you can try to pull a double-cross or the like on a spying nation, suckering them into invading when your fleet is *actually* right there waiting at the entry WP). Not sure exactly how this would work yet.

As a bonus, both would serve as money sinks, if the benefits were good enough. I think it would also present important decision-making opportunities regarding where to try to get embassies with a limited number of FSP (maybe FSP needs to not be part of it though). Thoughts?
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Re: Strategic Intelligence ... aka how to learn about aliens

Postby Cralis on Tue 15 May 2018 15:28

olivertheorem wrote:Was driving to work this morning when I had a thought about how to handle strategic-level intelligence without introducing an entirely new mechanic to the game. Will probably need to be fleshed out by veterans, but I thought I'd throw it out there.

We need a new facility: the Embassy. The idea being, an official embassy would easily serve as a front for spies. It would be a trade offer of a sort (could be 2 kinds, one to put the embassy on the other race's home planet, and another for elsewhere in the empire), which if accepted would work thus. Player pays X MCr and uses 1 FSP (of his own) to build an embassy in the NPR's space. Having said embassy would have some minor benefit to trade offers (no idea what the particulars would be), but you can ALSO use it for spycraft. For example, you could have "focused spying", similar to a focused research breakthrough, where you can specify the info you're trying to gather, and you could also have "random spying", more like random breakthroughs.


This is getting into the covert side of espionage. I actually have embassy as a facility for when we get to covert espionage. Except the embassy gives the allowing empire a bonus with their negotiations and relations with the embassy empire. The allowing empire will want embassies with other empires for that bonus, but the embassy empire will collect public information and conduct espionage from the embassy. The allowing empire will also have limited espionage through the embassy to ymthe embassy empire. The negotiating bonus AND the espionage potential would depend upon the population size of the allowing enpire, presence of ICC, and would peak at the empire homeworld and/or capitol.

We might even allowing empires with embassies at the same place to negotiate with each other even if they have no other contact in the game.

Although I like your idea that maybe it could boost trade. I imagine lots of lobbiests and business leaders would relish the opportunity to pitch directly to an ambassador who would be looking for opportunities to benefit his empire...

THEN, if you have embassies in your territory and want to make sure they're not spying, you can invest funds in counter-espionage (maybe even to the point where you can try to pull a double-cross or the like on a spying nation, suckering them into invading when your fleet is *actually* right there waiting at the entry WP). Not sure exactly how this would work yet.


True.

As a bonus, both would serve as money sinks, if the benefits were good enough. I think it would also present important decision-making opportunities regarding where to try to get embassies with a limited number of FSP (maybe FSP needs to not be part of it though). Thoughts?


Espionage both overt and covert would be beneficial and could cost a bundle.
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