tech

A three player campaign gone horribly wrong.

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tech

Postby Arknok on Mon 16 Sep 2013 21:06

So a while back i was think about how the Narm think. When we started playng we rolled the races up on the alien creation tables from GURPS space 4th ed. The Narm started out as a trapping carnivore. The dont think in terms of long range battles witch was how I was first going about it. They think in terms of setting traps and then when the enemy is immobilized they finish them off. The standard ultra tech tree is not set up for this. I thought i would run some ideas by you guys as to tech they might develop since this game has turned into a solo game.

Areas of tech they would develop:

Capital tractor beam branch- bigger tractor beams that slow down ships more then a regular one.

Heavy tractor beam branch- same as above.

Gravity anchor - kind of thinking of some like eveonline's webifier. rationale: It creates a entanglement of a ships drive field with the local gravity well. the stronger the drive feild and gravity well the more effect is achieved. would not work on Cp drive or a drive field down vessel. Might interfere with tractor beams as well.

Tractor beams on bouys - put on bouys but not useful by its self. Would have to combine with the gravity anchor to be actually useful.

those are some ideas. what do you guys think?
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Re: tech

Postby Cralis on Mon 16 Sep 2013 22:21

We've discussed some other methods of slowing ships down other than ADM, but we haven't come to any conclusions. The problem usually stems from the fact that if you make it to easy to impact speed, it becomes a serious slowing point in the gameplay.

Having said that, if you want to do it for your game and you're willing to accept the challenge, it will certainly make your game unique! That's always a bonus in my book. Plus, we've not done a lot of experimentation with those types of devices, so it will be interesting to see how it works for you.

How about this for an idea: what if T on buoys could tractor smcft and/or squadrons?
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Re: tech

Postby Arknok on Thu 19 Sep 2013 21:30

Cralis wrote:
How about this for an idea: what if T on buoys could tractor smcft and/or squadrons?


I thought about this, but i assumed you had considered something like this and thought it unbalancing. I am uncertain that it would effective as the buoy mass would be so much smaller than a shuttle, fighter, or gunboat. also using one buoy to tractor a squadron or group of strikes me as ineffective. If you throw in something that lets the buoy grip space/subspace that might work. think of the grav anchors here. hmm... what if the anchors act more like screw anchors in drywall. eg they hold position better rather then slow down the target. another option is for it to interdict missiles. It would do this by tractoring the missiles and either holding them in place or tearing them apart form perpendicular stresses from direction of thrust?

That brings to mind another item: what about a tech item that allows more than one tractor beam to lock on a given target?
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Re: tech

Postby Cralis on Thu 19 Sep 2013 21:36

Arknok wrote:
Cralis wrote:
How about this for an idea: what if T on buoys could tractor smcft and/or squadrons?


I thought about this, but i assumed you had considered something like this and thought it unbalancing.


Two things to consider:

First, some things we decided to either wait for a higher SL or not use because it would change how the game plays. That's not a bad thing when you are trying to make your campaign unique from other campaigns. For example, could you have fighters from the very start? Sure, you'd have to make them much, much weaker, but it would certainly make the campaign based on it different from the regular rules.

I am uncertain that it would effective as the buoy mass would be so much smaller than a shuttle, fighter, or gunboat. also using one buoy to tractor a squadron or group of strikes me as ineffective. If you throw in something that lets the buoy grip space/subspace that might work. think of the grav anchors here. hmm... what if the anchors act more like screw anchors in drywall. eg they hold position better rather then slow down the target. another option is for it to interdict missiles. It would do this by tractoring the missiles and either holding them in place or tearing them apart form perpendicular stresses from direction of thrust?


Perhaps that might work in your universe :) You do have to be careful as other players will gleefully come up with alternative uses to your ideas!

That brings to mind another item: what about a tech item that allows more than one tractor beam to lock on a given target?


In SOLAR STARFIRE you can make as many lock attempts as you want, but only one can exist at the end of the turn. I'm not sure how useful this would be unless it allowed multiples from different units. It would be different... and it would make towing a LOT easier assuming both (or more) of your ships are working together.
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Re: tech

Postby PracticalM on Fri 20 Sep 2013 09:32

I was thinking about how I'd want to slow a ship down and one thing I thought of was allowing some kind of warhead that slowed the ship down for 1 tactical turn. Some kind of gravitational effect disrupting the DF to slow the ship down.

Require a 2 damage missile or larger (Pt, Ga, Rc)
-1 MP for next tactical turn
Max of -1MP per any ship
Allow Td a chance to negate the effect

Call it a tractor warhead. allow it to be improved in later generations to allow 2 hits to give a -2 and so on.

And I don't think if you change the SL of something you have to make it weaker you just have to realize players will use it more. A Starfire game where fighters and gunboats are low tech is a universe with mostly carriers and gunboat WP assaults. It just changes the emphasis of what to develop and deploy
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Re: tech

Postby Cralis on Fri 20 Sep 2013 12:09

PracticalM wrote:And I don't think if you change the SL of something you have to make it weaker you just have to realize players will use it more. A Starfire game where fighters and gunboats are low tech is a universe with mostly carriers and gunboat WP assaults. It just changes the emphasis of what to develop and deploy


Your last two sentences are exactly what I was meaning to say.

Having said that, if you don't change the damage rates of FQ and GB from the SL6+ rates when you move them down to SL 1, you'll do so much damage with them that there is no choice but to use that technology. SCC (and anyone else) trying to make a unique game by shifting around the technologies should be aware of this result. If you don't want all of your players to use just the one kind of technology, you'll need to change the values to make it balanced for the new SL.
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Re: tech

Postby Arknok on Thu 16 Jan 2014 03:49

@PracicalM thanks for your comments. Ive been thinking about what you said but cant come up with a reply worth printing.

Sooo…. A tech item called: tractor beam harmonic. It allows tractor beams from multiple units to lock on to a given target. Developed for deployment on wp defense stations , it is designed to immobilize enemy wp assault units by tractoring from opposing multiple stations. Each station has a tractor beam harmonic installed along with some generation of Z. The units coordinate over the datalink channel allowing them to maintain tractor beam lock from multiple units.

1 hull space?

What do you guys think the MC cost should be? Its useless by its self. On the other hand it can trap enemies on your side of the wp to be pounded to death at your leisure. Or is that pleasure? :)

Do you allow a buoy version?

The Aswan have a unique tech item of their own. (elint) allows for the remote surveillance of enemy worlds in the same system by analyzing stray radio traffic that leaks past in orbit com satellites. It has to be combined with current gen science Instruments, the package together is ten hull spaces. Not sure on cost. I think that it alllows an extra general intelligence roll? The Aswan were using it to spy on the Merkoi in order to judge the proper time for their campaign of ‘liberation’. That got put on hold when the Relani demanded their surrender….

This probably got answered somewhere else, but does the rapid fire twig apply to the D tree?(in ultra rules)

Another item I’ve been thinking about. What about graded researchers? Some suggested abilities is to convert racial tech benefits into whole trees. Or adapting someone else's racial tech to your own tech base.

Another random tech item: armor piercing nukes.:) You put a cap of neutroium or collapsium (reference HBeam Piper) over the warhead. This would allow the weapon to skip armor before detonating .

Could a missile’s drive field be deformed to the point where it generates a stand off affect like the xray laser warheads form the Honor universe? Only it works with all LRW weapons.

Another random question: the standard drive takes the inertia of movement at significant percentages of light speed and spreads it across the surface of the drive field. What happens if you reverse this and focus that energy at a single internal point? Does this generate a singularly? Or maybe it generates the opening of one side a a wormhole?

Anybody want to poke holes?:)
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Re: tech

Postby Cralis on Thu 16 Jan 2014 12:09

Arknok wrote:This probably got answered somewhere else, but does the rapid fire twig apply to the D tree?(in ultra rules)


No. By definition, point defense is already "rapid fire"

Another item I’ve been thinking about. What about graded researchers? Some suggested abilities is to convert racial tech benefits into whole trees. Or adapting someone else's racial tech to your own tech base.


How about as a graded governor skill? Those benefits, however, would be extremely overpowering. Better if he gave bonuses to the RP limit or reduced cost or something.

Another random tech item: armor piercing nukes.:) You put a cap of neutroium or collapsium (reference HBeam Piper) over the warhead. This would allow the weapon to skip armor before detonating .


Not possible. All matter is vaporized when it crosses the DF boundary. Nukes are actually presumed to detonate outside of the DF. That is why they do extra damage against DF down targets, because they can detonate much closer (and without the mitigating effect of the DF)

But let's presume you allow this for DF down targets (which will probably never matter since 90% of DF down targets will be severly damaged and without armor): that cap would absorb some of the nuke detonation. I'd probably treat it as if there was no DF down multiplier.

Another random question: the standard drive takes the inertia of movement at significant percentages of light speed and spreads it across the surface of the drive field.


Not how it works. The DF works by moving the bubble the ship is in, while the ship remains at rest in the bubble. Your description is similar to the Alkeda Dawn version of the J drive, which Marvin rejected in ULTRA because of possibilities like the one you're thinking.
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Re: tech

Postby Vandervecken on Fri 17 Jan 2014 02:12

Arknok wrote: .

(reference HBeam Piper)




I always get a 'Fuzzy' warm feeling every time I hear that name.
I weary of the chasssse. Wait for me. I will be mercccciful and quick.
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