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Re: Who would like to try an experiment?

PostPosted: Tue 17 May 2016 08:00
by Cralis
That isn't the purpose of this experiment. There will be a progression, but based on the story we will build.

Ok, since there is interest I'll figure out the details and get the first part out later this week. We'll start with a two week turn around and see how it goes. It sounds like we may have different participants each cycle as players have time, and that's fine with me!

Re: Who would like to try an experiment?

PostPosted: Thu 19 May 2016 03:48
by noname_hero
Whitecold wrote:Just somehow there seems to be a repeating story here. In any case, playable scenarios sound very good for introducing people to the game.
Starting out with the QSR rules seems good, however I wonder if it might not be useful to eventually move on, and build scenarios that incorporate more and more advanced concepts, of course then requiring the full ruleset that you end up with a playable tutorial series where you gently can introduce XO racks, tractors, precision weapons, capital weapons, armed smallcraft, armed AP, a landing scenario to help us learn the new invasion rules, a test of Zc vs Z.
Of course the two things don't have to be mutually exclusive, but I guess one series is enough to handle for now.


I'm not sure what the later scenarios should focus on. Your ideas certainly have their merit but I've got to admit that the already existing scenarios were enough to explain the basics of tactical scale to me. Sure, I've read the first four main Starfire books first, but even the simple scenarios did a good job of explaining how the basic rules work. XO racks or capital weapons are not that much of a change, rules-wise.

I'm glad to see new scenarios to learn on and I'll be happy to test them. But while the record-keeping can be a bit tedious, the tactical scale seems reasonably easy and straightforward. I'm sure I'll run into some new surprises, like the first time I've tried to simulate an attack against a base and ran into its increased range, but thats a problem caused by parameters of some technologies, not a system change. The only thing I'd say needs to be added is some sort of small craft scenario and BASV.

The thing that is hardest for me to learn is the strategic aspects of the game. I'll admit that one of the reasons why I became interested in Starfire was an RPG I was gamemastering at the time (I've been thinking I might benefit from taking a look at how other people simulate the strategic side of a military SF campaign) - and I soon realized the Starfire ruleset was too cumbersome for my purposes. The sheer volume of the rules and the often spaghetti-like structure of the rules mean it takes hours and hours for a newbie to setup an empire, and hours more to play out the first few turns where absolutely nothing interesting is likely to happen.

So if somebody was to find the time and energy to create something more for newbies, the thing I would like to see would be more help with the strategic scale. Truth is, if I wasn't drawn in by the fiction and by the storytelling potential of the game, I would be almost certainly put off by the strategic rules.

Re: Who would like to try an experiment?

PostPosted: Thu 19 May 2016 14:12
by Cralis
NoName, the strategic rules were definitely not written with "casual" in mind. The newbie experience was a good part of why Lomn wrote the "Ernie Earthling" strategic examples. You see that topic at viewtopic.php?f=61&t=2563&hilit=ernie#p30467

I am curious why you think the rules are "spaghetti rules", but please private message me so we don't derail this topic.

Back to this topic:

So I think I know how I want this story to start and a direction to progress. Although the purpose is not to make training scenarios or expand the QSR rules, if we keep this going I'll have to add some techs to the stylized QSR rules.

I am not going to require the miniature rules, but I will be using them and encouraging you to use them as well. :)

I have my last training class on Saturday, so my goal is to have the introduction and scenario out on Sunday.

Re: Who would like to try an experiment?

PostPosted: Mon 23 May 2016 10:28
by Cralis
Updates! I've gotten the introduction scenario written and the introductory story partially done. I will conduct a test run tonight and finish the story... with the goal to release it tonight. I will be creating a new fiction subforum for this, so watch for it in the fiction section.

Re: Who would like to try an experiment?

PostPosted: Tue 24 May 2016 12:10
by Cralis
Ugh. My apologies, I had to watch the kids last night so I didn't get it finished. Normally I wouldn't get all personal like this, but I kinda feel like a jerk not being done yet...

Re: Who would like to try an experiment?

PostPosted: Tue 31 May 2016 08:53
by Cralis
Well what the heck. I posted the new stuff right before I left for this marvelous weekend. So... I just logged back on to see how everyone received it and it's not there.

I just spent my breakfast time looking into the issue... it seems our host had a SQL server issue on Friday evening. I don't see any emails from ya'll about it being down, but apparently they had some sort of failover crash that took about an hour to resolve. So I'm guessing that my post was eaten.

Did nobody else notice?

Anyway, I'm re-posting the intro story but I have to leave for work. I'll get on a little bit later and re-post the actual scenario.